Michael Campion: Let's move on to brand protocol number four, which talks to facts and beliefs.

Bob Sheard: Yeah, facts and beliefs very much relates to thoughts and feelings. We are in the facts and the beliefs business. We must, when we create a brand, realise the truth is important but it's not always necessary and sometimes we're myth making. It's about the truth of the narrative and the meaning of the narrative, and the truth in that that's important. So we do need facts, but we also need to shape beliefs. The reason that's important is beliefs shape behaviour. So one of the brands we worked with was Al Gore. The former Vice President of America has a private equity fund called Generation and we worked with them on the growth equity part of that business. And what really struck us is his belief in sustainable capitalism that 7 billion people on the planet, moving to 9 billion, represented the largest investment opportunity in our economic lifetime. It's that belief that shaped investment protocols to invest in things like solar city. So you can see how the importance of beliefs actually shapes practical reality and practical investment and manifests in the physical world. That was very much the same with the work that we did for Dalesford Organic. It was their belief in farming the right way, farming holistically, from farm to fork that shaped the practices that helped them to become really one of the world's benchmarks in organic food production today. So very much how beliefs can help shape not only the behaviour of those within the brand but also the consumption patterns of those outside the brand, and can be a real force for positive change. Absolutely, and I think not to turn this into a political masterclass, but it does again relate back to the difference between brand Trump and brand Clinton, doesn't it?

Michael Campion: And you see it in various politicians all across the globe that those who can speak to beliefs are far more persuasive than those who speak in facts and figures and left brain logical thinking. Is there any other aspects? Yeah, I mean, can you think of any other examples that speak to that?

Bob Sheard: One of the most dominant brands in the world that we've all experienced was predicated in a belief of a nation built by the people, of the people for the people, and that's the brand of the United States of America. And, as imperfect as that brand is, it has been in the balance of history, a force for good that's had some amazing cultural and still is an amazing cultural totem for Western civilization, but built on a set of beliefs, not necessarily a set of facts.